[Geoserver-users] Mapbuilder X Java Applets

GeoServer GeoServer User
1

Hello,

I am starting to use GeoServer to develop Geographical Information Systems.

I want your opinion about which client to use: use Mapbuilder or use a Java Applet to display the maps?

In my opinion:

*** JAVA APPLET ADVANTAGES: ***

  • More interactivity (better then Javascript and AJAX)
  • Java is easier to deploy then Javascript
  • Java Applets work identically in any browser

*** JAVA APPLET DISADVANTAGES: ***

  • The user will need to install Java (if not already installed)

I am seriously thinking about using Java Applets instead of MapBuilder or any other Javascript/AJAX based framework. What is your opinion??

Thanks,

Daniel

2

Hmm, well I'm not sure I totally agree with 2 and 3 in your "java applet pros" column.

Javascript is actually significantly easier to deploy than java. You just put it in the <script> header on your webpage and you're done. Yes, browser incompatibilities are a pain, but certainly no harder to debug than the differences in AWT semantics from Java 1.2 to Java 1.5.

Also, 100% of the people browsing the web have a web browser, and some huge percentage have a browser which supports modern javascript.

Not sure what the latest java-applet-capable browser market share is, but it's defenitely not as high as the above "modern javascript" share.

If you're really looking for a rich client technology that has incredible market penetration, take a look at Flash. Flash v7 (or above) is installed in something just less than 95% of all browsers. That's a REALLY rich platform for developing seamless browser-based client applications that has yet to be thoroughly exploited by the FOSS GIS community.

In the end it comes down to your relationship to your end-users. If you can "require" that they install java, then your choice of technology can be driven by your expertise-in/desire-to-use Java applets.

If you need to "attract" users to your product, then it's possible you may find more success using a more widely deployed client technology like flash or Javascript/AJAX.

By the way, Mapbuilder (mapbuilder.sourceforge.net) is a *great* AJAX-based WMS/WFS client toolkit. You can do some amazing things with it that make it seem VERY rich in its client behavior.

When you have a prototype or something up and running please let us know what you chose and let us check it out! It's always exciting when folks create applications that show off geoserver!

good luck,
--saul

Daniel Ferreira wrote:

Hello,

I am starting to use GeoServer to develop Geographical Information Systems.

I want your opinion about which client to use: use Mapbuilder or use a Java Applet to display the maps?

In my opinion:

*** JAVA APPLET ADVANTAGES: ***
- More interactivity (better then Javascript and AJAX)
- Java is easier to deploy then Javascript
- Java Applets work identically in any browser

*** JAVA APPLET DISADVANTAGES: ***
- The user will need to install Java (if not already installed)

I am seriously thinking about using Java Applets instead of MapBuilder or any other Javascript/AJAX based framework. What is your opinion??

Thanks,

Daniel

------------------------------------------------------------------------

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Geoserver-users mailing list
Geoserver-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/geoserver-users

3

Another one to check out is http://openlayers.org Javascript, and incredibly easy to deploy.

I agree about flash though, I think one of the biggest reason we haven't seen more is it's not open source and free to develop on, so there hasn't been a real community around it. But it's got incredible penetration, by far the easiest to deploy, since it works the same in all browsers and everyone's already got it installed. Worldkit does some nice stuff in the GIS domain. I think a few people have had some success with flash toolkits like openlazlo and maybe another?

I personally wouldn't do java applets, mostly because most people don't have them installed, and in actual implementations I find them no more interactive than good javascript or flash. But people have built some nice stuff with them.

Chris

Saul Farber wrote:

Hmm, well I'm not sure I totally agree with 2 and 3 in your "java applet pros" column.

Javascript is actually significantly easier to deploy than java. You just put it in the <script> header on your webpage and you're done. Yes, browser incompatibilities are a pain, but certainly no harder to debug than the differences in AWT semantics from Java 1.2 to Java 1.5.

Also, 100% of the people browsing the web have a web browser, and some huge percentage have a browser which supports modern javascript.

Not sure what the latest java-applet-capable browser market share is, but it's defenitely not as high as the above "modern javascript" share.

If you're really looking for a rich client technology that has incredible market penetration, take a look at Flash. Flash v7 (or above) is installed in something just less than 95% of all browsers. That's a REALLY rich platform for developing seamless browser-based client applications that has yet to be thoroughly exploited by the FOSS GIS community.

In the end it comes down to your relationship to your end-users. If you can "require" that they install java, then your choice of technology can be driven by your expertise-in/desire-to-use Java applets.

If you need to "attract" users to your product, then it's possible you may find more success using a more widely deployed client technology like flash or Javascript/AJAX.

By the way, Mapbuilder (mapbuilder.sourceforge.net) is a *great* AJAX-based WMS/WFS client toolkit. You can do some amazing things with it that make it seem VERY rich in its client behavior.

When you have a prototype or something up and running please let us know what you chose and let us check it out! It's always exciting when folks create applications that show off geoserver!

good luck,
--saul

Daniel Ferreira wrote:

Hello,

I am starting to use GeoServer to develop Geographical Information Systems.

I want your opinion about which client to use: use Mapbuilder or use a Java Applet to display the maps?

In my opinion:

*** JAVA APPLET ADVANTAGES: ***
- More interactivity (better then Javascript and AJAX)
- Java is easier to deploy then Javascript
- Java Applets work identically in any browser

*** JAVA APPLET DISADVANTAGES: ***
- The user will need to install Java (if not already installed)

I am seriously thinking about using Java Applets instead of MapBuilder or any other Javascript/AJAX based framework. What is your opinion??

Thanks,

Daniel

------------------------------------------------------------------------

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Geoserver-users mailing list
Geoserver-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/geoserver-users

_______________________________________________
Geoserver-users mailing list
Geoserver-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/geoserver-users

--
Chris Holmes
The Open Planning Project
http://topp.openplans.org

4

I have a couple projects that use a Flash client with a postGIS-Geoserver
back end, and have more projects on the way. I don't have a Flash
"toolkit", these are done in Flash "from scratch", but I'm getting to the
point where I'm reusing a lot of the code, and a developing some kind of
toolkit may be the way to go. But I really like Flash for its user
experience and near ubiquitousness.

http://www.cei.psu.edu/soiltool/semTool_phase2.html

This one is a mix of wfs and wms. Just enter a soil series name in the box
and hit the button.... "allegheny" "williams" "lily" and my favorite
"luckenbach" are a few of the 22000 series names. Please note that the mlra
layer currently draws from the wms very slowly since it is a very hi
resoulution data set that will be generalized for the next version....for
best results view the mlra layer only when zoomed to the soil extent.

http://www.geovista.psu.edu/grants/CDC/

This one draws the map via wfs-xml. It doesn't make use of much of the
geographic functions of Geoserver, but it does take advantage of having a
good postgreSQL database to deal with the 50,000 columns of variables.

Steve

Stephen Crawford
Center for Environmental Informatics
GeoVISTA Center
The Pennsylvania State University
814.865.9905
src176@anonymised.com

-----Original Message-----
From: geoserver-users-bounces@lists.sourceforge.net
[mailto:geoserver-users-bounces@lists.sourceforge.net] On Behalf Of Saul
Farber
Sent: Monday, June 05, 2006 6:29 PM
To: Daniel Ferreira
Cc: geoserver-users@lists.sourceforge.net
Subject: Re: [Geoserver-users] Mapbuilder X Java Applets

Hmm, well I'm not sure I totally agree with 2 and 3 in your "java applet
pros" column.

Javascript is actually significantly easier to deploy than java. You just
put it in the <script> header on your webpage and you're done.
Yes, browser incompatibilities are a pain, but certainly no harder to debug
than the differences in AWT semantics from Java 1.2 to Java 1.5.

Also, 100% of the people browsing the web have a web browser, and some huge
percentage have a browser which supports modern javascript.

Not sure what the latest java-applet-capable browser market share is, but
it's defenitely not as high as the above "modern javascript" share.

If you're really looking for a rich client technology that has
incredible market penetration, take a look at Flash. Flash v7 (or
above) is installed in something just less than 95% of all browsers.
That's a REALLY rich platform for developing seamless browser-based
client applications that has yet to be thoroughly exploited by the FOSS
GIS community.

In the end it comes down to your relationship to your end-users. If you
can "require" that they install java, then your choice of technology can
be driven by your expertise-in/desire-to-use Java applets.

If you need to "attract" users to your product, then it's possible you
may find more success using a more widely deployed client technology
like flash or Javascript/AJAX.

By the way, Mapbuilder (mapbuilder.sourceforge.net) is a *great*
AJAX-based WMS/WFS client toolkit. You can do some amazing things with
it that make it seem VERY rich in its client behavior.

When you have a prototype or something up and running please let us know
what you chose and let us check it out! It's always exciting when folks
create applications that show off geoserver!

good luck,
--saul

Daniel Ferreira wrote:

Hello,

I am starting to use GeoServer to develop Geographical Information

Systems.

I want your opinion about which client to use: use Mapbuilder or use a
Java Applet to display the maps?

In my opinion:

*** JAVA APPLET ADVANTAGES: ***
- More interactivity (better then Javascript and AJAX)
- Java is easier to deploy then Javascript
- Java Applets work identically in any browser

*** JAVA APPLET DISADVANTAGES: ***
- The user will need to install Java (if not already installed)

I am seriously thinking about using Java Applets instead of MapBuilder
or any other Javascript/AJAX based framework. What is your opinion??

Thanks,

Daniel

------------------------------------------------------------------------

_______________________________________________
Geoserver-users mailing list
Geoserver-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/geoserver-users

_______________________________________________
Geoserver-users mailing list
Geoserver-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/geoserver-users

5

Very cool. Do you mind if I put a picture and link in the gallery? http://docs.codehaus.org/display/GEOSDOC/Gallery

Also any chance you can share the flash source code? Other's might be interested in re-using. would be very nice if you could write up a 'Use Narrative' http://docs.codehaus.org/display/GEOSDOC/Use+Narrative Just kind of informally blog what you've done with GeoServer, so that others may know the possibilities of flash.

Stephen Crawford wrote:

I have a couple projects that use a Flash client with a postGIS-Geoserver
back end, and have more projects on the way. I don't have a Flash
"toolkit", these are done in Flash "from scratch", but I'm getting to the
point where I'm reusing a lot of the code, and a developing some kind of
toolkit may be the way to go. But I really like Flash for its user
experience and near ubiquitousness.

http://www.cei.psu.edu/soiltool/semTool_phase2.html

This one is a mix of wfs and wms. Just enter a soil series name in the box
and hit the button.... "allegheny" "williams" "lily" and my favorite
"luckenbach" are a few of the 22000 series names. Please note that the mlra
layer currently draws from the wms very slowly since it is a very hi
resoulution data set that will be generalized for the next version....for
best results view the mlra layer only when zoomed to the soil extent.

http://www.geovista.psu.edu/grants/CDC/

This one draws the map via wfs-xml. It doesn't make use of much of the
geographic functions of Geoserver, but it does take advantage of having a
good postgreSQL database to deal with the 50,000 columns of variables.

Steve

Stephen Crawford
Center for Environmental Informatics
GeoVISTA Center
The Pennsylvania State University
814.865.9905
src176@anonymised.com

-----Original Message-----
From: geoserver-users-bounces@lists.sourceforge.net
[mailto:geoserver-users-bounces@lists.sourceforge.net] On Behalf Of Saul
Farber
Sent: Monday, June 05, 2006 6:29 PM
To: Daniel Ferreira
Cc: geoserver-users@lists.sourceforge.net
Subject: Re: [Geoserver-users] Mapbuilder X Java Applets

Hmm, well I'm not sure I totally agree with 2 and 3 in your "java applet
pros" column.

Javascript is actually significantly easier to deploy than java. You just
put it in the <script> header on your webpage and you're done. Yes, browser incompatibilities are a pain, but certainly no harder to debug
than the differences in AWT semantics from Java 1.2 to Java 1.5.

Also, 100% of the people browsing the web have a web browser, and some huge
percentage have a browser which supports modern javascript.

Not sure what the latest java-applet-capable browser market share is, but
it's defenitely not as high as the above "modern javascript" share.

If you're really looking for a rich client technology that has incredible market penetration, take a look at Flash. Flash v7 (or above) is installed in something just less than 95% of all browsers. That's a REALLY rich platform for developing seamless browser-based client applications that has yet to be thoroughly exploited by the FOSS GIS community.

In the end it comes down to your relationship to your end-users. If you can "require" that they install java, then your choice of technology can be driven by your expertise-in/desire-to-use Java applets.

If you need to "attract" users to your product, then it's possible you may find more success using a more widely deployed client technology like flash or Javascript/AJAX.

By the way, Mapbuilder (mapbuilder.sourceforge.net) is a *great* AJAX-based WMS/WFS client toolkit. You can do some amazing things with it that make it seem VERY rich in its client behavior.

When you have a prototype or something up and running please let us know what you chose and let us check it out! It's always exciting when folks create applications that show off geoserver!

good luck,
--saul

Daniel Ferreira wrote:

Hello,

I am starting to use GeoServer to develop Geographical Information

Systems.

I want your opinion about which client to use: use Mapbuilder or use a Java Applet to display the maps?

In my opinion:

*** JAVA APPLET ADVANTAGES: ***
- More interactivity (better then Javascript and AJAX)
- Java is easier to deploy then Javascript
- Java Applets work identically in any browser

*** JAVA APPLET DISADVANTAGES: ***
- The user will need to install Java (if not already installed)

I am seriously thinking about using Java Applets instead of MapBuilder or any other Javascript/AJAX based framework. What is your opinion??

Thanks,

Daniel

------------------------------------------------------------------------

_______________________________________________
Geoserver-users mailing list
Geoserver-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/geoserver-users

_______________________________________________
Geoserver-users mailing list
Geoserver-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/geoserver-users

_______________________________________________
Geoserver-users mailing list
Geoserver-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/geoserver-users

!DSPAM:1003,4485a30657771365099012!

--
Chris Holmes
The Open Planning Project
http://topp.openplans.org

6

Hi,

At first I would like to thank you everybody, this mail list is being very useful.

Sorry, I wrote the wrong word, when I wrote DEPLOY I meant DEBUG. Javascript is much easier to deploy indeed. But in my opinion it is harder to debug. I have worked with Javascript in the past and I found it really painful, sometimes I spent hours or even days to discover what was wrong, or do do a relatively simple thing.

In most cases I can require that the end-user install Java, because the systems are developed for companies or organizations for internal use.

I think I will try to use Java Applets (as an experiment) when I can require the end-use to install Java, otherwise I use MapBuilder (or another AJAX based).

Thanks,

Daniel

On 6/5/06, Saul Farber <Saul.Farber@anonymised.com> wrote:

Hmm, well I’m not sure I totally agree with 2 and 3 in your “java applet
pros” column.

Javascript is actually significantly easier to deploy than java. You
just put it in the header on your webpage and you’re done.
Yes, browser incompatibilities are a pain, but certainly no harder to
debug than the differences in AWT semantics from Java 1.2 to Java 1.5.

Also, 100% of the people browsing the web have a web browser, and some
huge percentage have a browser which supports modern javascript.

Not sure what the latest java-applet-capable browser market share is,
but it’s defenitely not as high as the above “modern javascript” share.

If you’re really looking for a rich client technology that has
incredible market penetration, take a look at Flash. Flash v7 (or
above) is installed in something just less than 95% of all browsers.
That’s a REALLY rich platform for developing seamless browser-based
client applications that has yet to be thoroughly exploited by the FOSS
GIS community.

In the end it comes down to your relationship to your end-users. If you
can “require” that they install java, then your choice of technology can
be driven by your expertise-in/desire-to-use Java applets.

If you need to “attract” users to your product, then it’s possible you
may find more success using a more widely deployed client technology
like flash or Javascript/AJAX.

By the way, Mapbuilder (mapbuilder.sourceforge.net) is a great
AJAX-based WMS/WFS client toolkit. You can do some amazing things with
it that make it seem VERY rich in its client behavior.

When you have a prototype or something up and running please let us know
what you chose and let us check it out! It’s always exciting when folks
create applications that show off geoserver!

good luck,
–saul

Daniel Ferreira wrote:

Hello,

I am starting to use GeoServer to develop Geographical Information Systems.

I want your opinion about which client to use: use Mapbuilder or use a
Java Applet to display the maps?

In my opinion:

*** JAVA APPLET ADVANTAGES: ***

  • More interactivity (better then Javascript and AJAX)
  • Java is easier to deploy then Javascript
  • Java Applets work identically in any browser

*** JAVA APPLET DISADVANTAGES: ***

  • The user will need to install Java (if not already installed)

I am seriously thinking about using Java Applets instead of MapBuilder
or any other Javascript/AJAX based framework. What is your opinion??

Thanks,

Daniel