[GRASS5] r.le in GRASS-5?

Rich_Shepard · July 4, 2001, 1:55pm

On Wed, 4 Jul 2001, Markus Neteler wrote:

William Baker (http://www.uwyo.edu/geog/faculty/baker.html) has been
working on it, however, I don't know if the update is finished.

He may answer this questions,

Thanks, Markus. I know that Bill developed this originally, but I did not
know if it was still alive and breathing. I have a need to use it in a
project, so I'll wait for more information.

Rich

Dr. Richard B. Shepard, President

                       Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc. (TM)
            2404 SW 22nd Street | Troutdale, OR 97060-1247 | U.S.A.
+ 1 503-667-4517 (voice) | + 1 503-667-8863 (fax) | rshepard@appl-ecosys.com
                 Making environmentally-responsible mining happen.

bakerwl1 · July 4, 2001, 4:39pm

Hello Rich and others,

I am indeed working on a version of r.le for
GRASS 5. I have a version of r.le.patch and
r.le.pixel that seem to run fine. The only
serious remaining bug is in r.le.setup. I wrote
to the programmer's list about this one a couple
of months ago, but no-one had a solution. Until
I can solve this one, r.le.setup is unusable.

I also have not yet tested all the parts of r.le.patch
and r.le.pixel to see that the output numbers are
correct.

So, there is some work yet to do before I can
release the new version.

Right now I am in the field, checking email only
every few days. When I return to Laramie in early
August I hope to make more progress.

Sorry for the slow revision, but it is still on
my list to be completed.

Bill Baker

-----Original Message-----
From: Rich Shepard [mailto:rshepard@appl-ecosys.com]
Sent: Wednesday, July 04, 2001 7:56 AM
To: Markus Neteler
Cc: grass5@geog.uni-hannover.de; bakerwl@uwyo.edu
Subject: Re: [GRASS5] r.le in GRASS-5?

On Wed, 4 Jul 2001, Markus Neteler wrote:

William Baker (http://www.uwyo.edu/geog/faculty/baker.html) has been
working on it, however, I don't know if the update is finished.

He may answer this questions,

Thanks, Markus. I know that Bill developed this originally, but I did not
know if it was still alive and breathing. I have a need to use it in a
project, so I'll wait for more information.

Rich

Dr. Richard B. Shepard, President

                       Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc. (TM)
            2404 SW 22nd Street | Troutdale, OR 97060-1247 | U.S.A.
+ 1 503-667-4517 (voice) | + 1 503-667-8863 (fax) |
rshepard@appl-ecosys.com
                 Making environmentally-responsible mining happen.

From neteler Thu Jul 5 14:48:40 2001
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Hi all,

On Thu, Jul 05, 2001 at 02:27:11PM +0200, Andrea Aime wrote:

Markus Neteler wrote:
>
> Hi Andrea,
>
> On Wed, Jul 04, 2001 at 05:55:01PM +0200, Andrea Aime wrote:
> > Hi Markus,
> > I've corrected s.voronoi bug, which manifested itself only when
> > there were two coincident sites: now the program uses only the
> > first one and discards all the remaining copies. I also improved
> > label handling, you'll see a description in the package attached
> > (I also updated html man page). I hope it will work pretty well also
> > for you, I didn't have the time to do extensive testing... sorry, it's
> > the best I can do now.
>
> thanks for the fix - I have uploaded into CVS.

Uhm, I hope it doesn't add other bugs... it would be nice if someone
else woul test try it...

[...]

Those being interested in s.voronoi may test the current CVS version.

Thanks (especially to Andrea!)

Markus

From neteler Thu Jul 5 14:51:40 2001
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From: Markus Neteler <neteler@geog.uni-hannover.de>
To: Glynn Clements <glynn.clements@virgin.net>
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Glynn

(cc to grass5)

as your improvements and comments may be of further interest,
I cc it to grass5.

Hi all: Glynn is currently improving the "gmath" lib to add further
maxtrix/vector functionality:

On Thu, Jul 05, 2001 at 12:08:22PM +0100, Glynn Clements wrote:

Glynn Clements wrote:

> I'll look at egvorder() and transpose() next (the latter should be
> trivial). The FFT stuff may be less straightforward.

G_matrix_transpose() already existed. I've added
G_matrix_eigen_sort(), which uses qsort() rather than an O(n^2)
algorithm.

I have a few comments about la.c generally:

1. It might be worth providing G_vector_{get,set}_element() functions.
The accessors for vectors are actually more involved than for
matrices, due to the need to handle both row and column vectors and
the v_indx field. OTOH, using such functions would typically impair
efficiency.

2. While G_matrix_init() and G_vector_init() have corresponding
G_matrix_free() and G_vector_free() functions, there aren't any
equivalents for G_matrix_set() and G_vector_set().

3. Passing in an existing vector (or matrix) to receive output is
potentially messy, due to the possibility of conflicts between the
provided and required dimensions, and the issue of whether the caller
or the function is responsible for initialisation. Returning a
dynamically-allocated vector (or matrix) is simpler.

4. There are a number of cases where "const" should be used in
parameter declarations. This is an issue with GRASS generally,
although performance might be more relevant with the gmath library.

--
Glynn Clements <glynn.clements@virgin.net>

Please let us know your thoughts,

Markus

From neteler Thu Jul 5 16:32:28 2001
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From: Markus Neteler <neteler@geog.uni-hannover.de>
To: "William L. Baker" <bakerwl@uwyo.edu>
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On Wed, Jul 04, 2001 at 10:39:50AM -0600, William L. Baker wrote:

Hello Rich and others,

I am indeed working on a version of r.le for
GRASS 5. I have a version of r.le.patch and
r.le.pixel that seem to run fine. The only
serious remaining bug is in r.le.setup. I wrote
to the programmer's list about this one a couple
of months ago, but no-one had a solution. Until
I can solve this one, r.le.setup is unusable.

Here is the old mail (I think so):
http://www.geog.uni-hannover.de/mailinglisten/grass5/archive/2000/12/17/7
http://www.geog.uni-hannover.de/mailinglisten/grass5/archive/2000/12/18/1

Perhaps useful to finally help Bill Baker!

I also have not yet tested all the parts of r.le.patch
and r.le.pixel to see that the output numbers are
correct.

So, there is some work yet to do before I can
release the new version.

Right now I am in the field, checking email only
every few days. When I return to Laramie in early
August I hope to make more progress.

Sorry for the slow revision, but it is still on
my list to be completed.

Bill Baker

Markus

-----Original Message-----
From: Rich Shepard [mailto:rshepard@appl-ecosys.com]
Sent: Wednesday, July 04, 2001 7:56 AM
To: Markus Neteler
Cc: grass5@geog.uni-hannover.de; bakerwl@uwyo.edu
Subject: Re: [GRASS5] r.le in GRASS-5?

On Wed, 4 Jul 2001, Markus Neteler wrote:

> William Baker (http://www.uwyo.edu/geog/faculty/baker.html) has been
> working on it, however, I don't know if the update is finished.
>
> He may answer this questions,

  Thanks, Markus. I know that Bill developed this originally, but I did not
know if it was still alive and breathing. I have a need to use it in a
project, so I'll wait for more information.

Rich

Dr. Richard B. Shepard, President

                       Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc. (TM)
            2404 SW 22nd Street | Troutdale, OR 97060-1247 | U.S.A.
+ 1 503-667-4517 (voice) | + 1 503-667-8863 (fax) |
rshepard@appl-ecosys.com
                 Making environmentally-responsible mining happen.

_______________________________________________
grass5 mailing list
grass5@geog.uni-hannover.de
http://www.geog.uni-hannover.de/mailman/listinfo/grass5

--
Markus Neteler * University of Hannover
Institute of Physical Geography and Landscape Ecology
Schneiderberg 50 * D-30167 Hannover * Germany
Tel: ++49-(0)511-762-4494 Fax: -3984

Michel_Wurtz1 · July 5, 2001, 5:20pm

Markus Neteler wrote:

On Wed, Jul 04, 2001 at 10:39:50AM -0600, William L. Baker wrote:
> Hello Rich and others,
>
> I am indeed working on a version of r.le for
> GRASS 5. I have a version of r.le.patch and
> r.le.pixel that seem to run fine. The only
> serious remaining bug is in r.le.setup. I wrote
> to the programmer's list about this one a couple
> of months ago, but no-one had a solution. Until
> I can solve this one, r.le.setup is unusable.

Here is the old mail (I think so):
http://www.geog.uni-hannover.de/mailinglisten/grass5/archive/2000/12/17/7
http://www.geog.uni-hannover.de/mailinglisten/grass5/archive/2000/12/18/1

And one more time, it's a null file related problem... It seems that a
good null values management is becomming an urgent need.
BTW, nobody commented my last proposal, which either means that everybody
agrees or that I'm way off out out of topic

--
Michel WURTZ - DIG - Maison de la télédétection
500, rue J.F. Breton
34093 MONTPELLIER Cedex 5

Eric_G_Miller · July 6, 2001, 1:15am

On Thu, Jul 05, 2001 at 05:20:35PM +0000, Michel Wurtz wrote:

Markus Neteler wrote:
>
> On Wed, Jul 04, 2001 at 10:39:50AM -0600, William L. Baker wrote:
> > Hello Rich and others,
> >
> > I am indeed working on a version of r.le for
> > GRASS 5. I have a version of r.le.patch and
> > r.le.pixel that seem to run fine. The only
> > serious remaining bug is in r.le.setup. I wrote
> > to the programmer's list about this one a couple
> > of months ago, but no-one had a solution. Until
> > I can solve this one, r.le.setup is unusable.
>
> Here is the old mail (I think so):
> http://www.geog.uni-hannover.de/mailinglisten/grass5/archive/2000/12/17/7
> http://www.geog.uni-hannover.de/mailinglisten/grass5/archive/2000/12/18/1

And one more time, it's a null file related problem... It seems that a
good null values management is becomming an urgent need.
BTW, nobody commented my last proposal, which either means that everybody
agrees or that I'm way off out out of topic

Frankly, the only problem I really see with the current NULL file
management is that for old maps, the user has to be concerned about
whether 0 == NULL or not. "r.null" fixes up that problem.

I still don't understand what it is that William Baker needs that
isn't already provided. There are functions that ascertain whether
any given cell is "NULL". How would it be different using NaN? You
still have to use IS_NAN() or some such. If using the newer interfaces,
all new files are created with a clear separation of NULL and 0.
There are functions for specifying that a cell should be NULL. You can
get the flag array for NULL values for any given row if you need it. If
you want to use some temp file with your own variant of NULL for easier
comparison, go for it.

I certainly don't think it gets any simpler if you move the
handling of the NULL representation to outside of libgis,
or if the values are embedded. Your modules still have to be prepared
to handle NULL, and NULL could be anything, so use G_is_null_value().

I don't see anything particularly wrong with wanting to embed NULL
values, but I certainly don't feel like diving into that raster code
again. It isn't broken. Lots of other things are. Is GRASS 5.0 ever
going to get released? Leave it for 5.1. It's just too dangerous to be
mucking in that territory if GRASS 5.0 is ever going to be released
before the next millenium.

--
Eric G. Miller <egm2@jps.net>

Roger_Bivand · July 6, 2001, 9:38am

On Thu, 5 Jul 2001, Eric G. Miller wrote:

On Thu, Jul 05, 2001 at 05:20:35PM +0000, Michel Wurtz wrote:
> Markus Neteler wrote:
> >
> And one more time, it's a null file related problem... It seems that a
> good null values management is becomming an urgent need.
> BTW, nobody commented my last proposal, which either means that everybody
> agrees or that I'm way off out out of topic

I certainly don't think it gets any simpler if you move the
handling of the NULL representation to outside of libgis,
or if the values are embedded. Your modules still have to be prepared
to handle NULL, and NULL could be anything, so use G_is_null_value().

I don't see anything particularly wrong with wanting to embed NULL
values, but I certainly don't feel like diving into that raster code
again. It isn't broken. Lots of other things are. Is GRASS 5.0 ever
going to get released? Leave it for 5.1. It's just too dangerous to be
mucking in that territory if GRASS 5.0 is ever going to be released
before the next millenium.

I think Eric is quite right. Leave changing the NULL functions until
5.1. We simply don't know how or which programs or functions use the NULL
API correctly for a simple replacement of NULL handling to be feasible. Of
course the present mechanism is an unsatisfactory hack, but it does work,
except when users don't know that 0 can be a missing data value.

Roger

--
Roger Bivand
Economic Geography Section, Department of Economics, Norwegian School of
Economics and Business Administration, Breiviksveien 40, N-5045 Bergen,
Norway. voice: +47 55 95 93 55; fax +47 55 95 93 93
e-mail: Roger.Bivand@nhh.no
and: Department of Geography and Regional Development, University of
Gdansk, al. Mar. J. Pilsudskiego 46, PL-81 378 Gdynia, Poland.

From neteler Fri Jul 6 11:20:52 2001
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Rich

(cc to Thomas Koester)

On Thu, Jul 05, 2001 at 08:37:16AM -0700, Rich Shepard wrote:

Markus,

Wow! These spammers are both clever and desparate. I wonder how they
cracked the mailman software to post spam on a subscription-only list.

no - they didn't.... The trick was that the have been posting to Request
Tracker (as far as I understand) which is not closed to subscribers and
automatically cross-posts to "grass5".

At time I don't know what we can do about this, probably Intevation/RT
needs a spam filter. Bug reports can't be closed, then nobody reports
any more.

Too bad!

Markus

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Subject: [GRASS5] [bug #763] (grass) DIE WILDESTE & MEGA AUSLESE VON ...
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Date: Thu, 5 Jul 2001 17:27:43 +0200 (CEST)

this bug's URL: http://intevation.de/rt/webrt?serial_num=763
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

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Subject: DIE WILDESTE & MEGA AUSLESE VON ...

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--
Markus Neteler * University of Hannover
Institute of Physical Geography and Landscape Ecology
Schneiderberg 50 * D-30167 Hannover * Germany
Tel: ++49-(0)511-762-4494 Fax: -3984

bakerwl1 · July 6, 2001, 8:55pm

Hi Markus and Eric,

Oops...I think Markus dug up the wrong old
message. That NaN stuff was cleared up for me
some time ago. The remaining problem has to do
with the monitor getting hung when a particular
function is used. I can't get to it right now,
but will re-send the message about the problem
when I return from fieldwork at the end of July.

Thanks for your interest and concern to help
solve r.le bugs...

Bill Baker

-----Original Message-----
From: grass5-admin@geog.uni-hannover.de
[mailto:grass5-admin@geog.uni-hannover.de]On Behalf Of Eric G. Miller
Sent: Thursday, July 05, 2001 7:15 PM
To: grass developpers
Subject: Re: [GRASS5] r.le in GRASS-5?

On Thu, Jul 05, 2001 at 05:20:35PM +0000, Michel Wurtz wrote:

Markus Neteler wrote:
>
> On Wed, Jul 04, 2001 at 10:39:50AM -0600, William L. Baker wrote:
> > Hello Rich and others,
> >
> > I am indeed working on a version of r.le for
> > GRASS 5. I have a version of r.le.patch and
> > r.le.pixel that seem to run fine. The only
> > serious remaining bug is in r.le.setup. I wrote
> > to the programmer's list about this one a couple
> > of months ago, but no-one had a solution. Until
> > I can solve this one, r.le.setup is unusable.
>
> Here is the old mail (I think so):
>

http://www.geog.uni-hannover.de/mailinglisten/grass5/archive/2000/12/17/7

>

http://www.geog.uni-hannover.de/mailinglisten/grass5/archive/2000/12/18/1

And one more time, it's a null file related problem... It seems that a
good null values management is becomming an urgent need.
BTW, nobody commented my last proposal, which either means that everybody
agrees or that I'm way off out out of topic

Frankly, the only problem I really see with the current NULL file
management is that for old maps, the user has to be concerned about
whether 0 == NULL or not. "r.null" fixes up that problem.

I still don't understand what it is that William Baker needs that
isn't already provided. There are functions that ascertain whether
any given cell is "NULL". How would it be different using NaN? You
still have to use IS_NAN() or some such. If using the newer interfaces,
all new files are created with a clear separation of NULL and 0.
There are functions for specifying that a cell should be NULL. You can
get the flag array for NULL values for any given row if you need it. If
you want to use some temp file with your own variant of NULL for easier
comparison, go for it.

I certainly don't think it gets any simpler if you move the
handling of the NULL representation to outside of libgis,
or if the values are embedded. Your modules still have to be prepared
to handle NULL, and NULL could be anything, so use G_is_null_value().

I don't see anything particularly wrong with wanting to embed NULL
values, but I certainly don't feel like diving into that raster code
again. It isn't broken. Lots of other things are. Is GRASS 5.0 ever
going to get released? Leave it for 5.1. It's just too dangerous to be
mucking in that territory if GRASS 5.0 is ever going to be released
before the next millenium.

--
Eric G. Miller <egm2@jps.net>
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