Justin Deoliveira wrote:
Just something that popped into my head. In the new geoserver
architecture I would like to see people be able to develop in their own
modules, and not everyone developing in a single geoserver module.
For me this idea sounds really useful. I spend some time with JBoss Portal -
which is doing this - and I'll try to find some analogies here (this will be
more like a high-level approach...):
For instance, geoserver could be made up of three modules:
1. org.openplans.geoserver.core
2. org.openplans.geoserver.wfs
3. org.openplans.geoserver.wms
JBoss Portal itself is something like an abstract container, providing core
functionalities like security, layout/ themes, content management - portal
stuff for J2EE.
Maybe this is comparable to abstract W*S services.
With descriptors an application developer creates one or more portal
instances inside JBoss Portal. Within each instance, these services can be
accessed with further descriptors and programmatically.
So back to geoserver - an application developer could create an own
instance, extending the functionality provided by the abstract container
(WMS, WFS...). This instance could be deployed as a seperate war, ear or
whatever and no hacking into the core module would be necessary.
http://www.jboss.org/products/jbossportal/docs
I reckon it's kind of hard to implement.
Martin
This has a number of benefits:
1. It provides a grouping of functionality that is stronger than java
packaging
2. Makes deployment easy, if you want to disable/enable a plugin, simply
remove it or add it.
3. prevents huge configuration files that everyone has to edit.
One of things I like about Spring, is that it allows the loading of
multiple "contexts". (for those familiar with eclipse, a context amounts to
a plugin.xml file).
Paolo, I imagine that JBoss has the ability to do something similar?
-Justin
P.Rizzi Ag.Mobilità Ambiente wrote:
So it seems we two are quite aligned, I too like Spring and JBoss!!!
I did many test with Spring a few months ago, and almost decided to use
it,
but then abandoned it in favor of JBoss, because we already decided to
use
it
as our application server, so there was no point in using yet another
library (Spring).>From what I've seen so far I can tell that the IoC container of Spring
is
much more poweful and developed, but JBoss' Microcontainer will soon
reach
it.
Aspect programming is a great thing. I did some tests months ago with
both
the Spring aspect framework and JBossAOP. They follow different
philosophies,
but I found JBossAOP to be much more powerful.JBoss strength is the integration with all other services (if you need
them,
but you're not obliged to), and in particular it's powerful Class Loading
system.So Spring is more "smart", but JBoss has a much larger "breadth",
though it's a bit difficult to grasp at first. Also one may have the
idea that JBoss technologies works only inside the application server,
but this is not the case, in fact most of them, work equally well
outside.
Take a look at this to have an idea of what they're developing the
Microcontainer for:
http://jboss.org/jbossBlog/blog/bburke/2005/09/29/JBoss_Microcontainer_Embed
dable_JBoss.txt
Anyway I'm not pushing JBoss, I just want to be sure that each option
is taken into account. I like Spring very much, so I'd be happy if it
would be chosen. It just seems to be less "enterprise" than JBoss...Bye
Paolo RizziP.S: Can you put up a polling form on the Wiki, or something like that???
Because EMail tends to go missing, after a while...Spring)
I must say I am leaning pretty heavily toward Spring, for a couple of
reasons:
1) It is fully featured web application framework
2) WebMVC is a nice substitute for struts
3) It is integratable with pretty much of the other web technologies out
there, including struts
4) I have found aspects to be a very nice way of organizing code
However my number one reason for liking Spring is the popularity it is
gaining. For instance, this year at OOPSLA Spring received much attention.
JBoss Microcontainer)
I eagerly await the full evaluation, I have done some research, here are
my thoughts.
>From what I can tell JBoss MicroContainer offers everything that Spring
does. However it still seems like JBoss Microcontainer is still the new guy
on the scene and most people are still using spring.
This is an article comparing the two:
http://www.javalobby.org/java/forums/t49723.html
Here is an interesting post that referes to JBoss licencing:
http://www.javalobby.org/java/forums/m91945483.html
So all in all I would have to say that my choice at this moment is
definitly Spring.
Any one else who has an opinion please chime in.
-Justin
P.Rizzi Ag.Mobilità Ambiente wrote:
I looked at:
http://docs.codehaus.org/display/GEOS/GeoServer+2.0+Technology
and saw you updated it with more detailed information, verygood work!!!
I'm experimenting a bit with JBoss Microcontainer and I
hope to be able
to add my experiments' results to the page soon.
I think we should start a sort of opinion poll.
Obviously you are free to decide as you like, but I think that
any "Humble and Biased" opinion, can be useful anyway.So, here follows mine (please imagine an implicit "I think..."
before each affirmation).Bye
Paolo Rizzi******************************************************************
.) OSGi
It's surely powerful, but not easily "embeddable".
It tends to want having things done in its own manner
and it may conflict with other container (J2EE in particular).
--- I'd not use it. ---.) Geronimo / GBeans
Light, flexible and embeddable enough, but it has nothing more than
JBoss / Microcontainer has, and it's not enough mature.
--- I'd not use it. ---
.) Spring
Very light, flexible and embeddable. It's designed to integrate,
not to conflict, with other containers and technology.
It optionally offers more than the plain container (MVC, AOP, etc.).
It's quite mature and supported, but maybe there're not many people
"behind" it, apart from its creator.
--- I'd use it. ---.) JBoss / Microcontainer Very light and flexible. The new
Microcontainer is embeddable
and it's designed to integrate, not to conflict, with other
containers.
JBoss optionally offers a lot more than the plain container
(MVC, AOP,
etc.).
It's very mature and supported, and there's a strongsupport "behind" it.
--- I'd use it. ---
Licenses details remains to be looked for (but I'm no
expert in this).
In the end I'd use JBoss / Microcontainer, because that's
what I've used
till now (JBoss, not the Microcontainer).
If for any reason this is judged not to be usable, I'd use Spring.
I see no reason to use Geronimo / GBeans instead of JBoss /Microcontainer.
I'd not use OSGi anyway.
******************************************************************-----Messaggio originale-----
Da: Justin Deoliveira [mailto:jdeolive@anonymised.com]
Inviato: lunedì 24 ottobre 2005 17.04
A: "P.Rizzi Ag.Mobilità Ambiente"
Cc: 'dblasby@anonymised.com'; Gabriel Roldán; "L.Percich Ag.Mobilità
Ambiente"; geoserver-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
Oggetto: Re: R: [Geoserver-devel] R: Geoserver EnterpriseHi Paolo,
I am glad you are interested in this topic. A technology
has not yet
been decided on, still in the evaluation stage. OSGi is just the first
one that I have had time to document. Next I plan to evaluate Geronimo.
Please feel free to add JBoss to the list of candidates. It you have
the time I would love if you could write some docs about why you think its a
good way to go.
The list of technologies on the page is by no means complete so please
add anything else you think should be there.
-Justin
P.Rizzi Ag.Mobilità Ambiente wrote:
Da: Justin Deoliveira [mailto:jdeolive@anonymised.com]
Inviato: venerdì 30 settembre 2005 19.20
We are in the process of putting up some wiki spacededicated to the
design. It would be nice to start refining some of the great
discussions that have been going on with OpenSDI and some of things you
guys have
been doing over the last little while into a architecure and high
level design.
Justin
Sorry for disappearing in the last weeks, but I've been taken
away with exporting data to remote Oracle instances...!!!I looked in the "RnD" Wiki space of GeoServer and saw the:
http://docs.codehaus.org/display/GEOS/GeoServer+2.0+Technology
page, that seems the most recently updated.The only technology actually analized in depth is OSGi,
does it means you already choose it, or simply is it the first one
you addressed???I'd like to add JBoss as a suitable technology, and also a couple
of other considerations. May I edit the page???I'm very interested in the proceeding of this and expecially in
Dave's sentence:
"...ps. from the last meeting, it appears the "data/catalog"
portion of the framework will be somewhat like an expanded
"DataEngine" (from the IRC meeting)...".
I found no reference to this in the Wiki though... Wherecan I find it???
Bye
Paolo RizziP.Rizzi Ag.Mobilità Ambiente wrote:
I read the transcript from yesterday's IRC meeting. Sorry
we couldnt
attend.
I'm sorry, because we probably didn't advertised the IRC
enough...
For the last 2 weeks, I have been in Victoria talking with
the two new
TOPP employees (Brent Owens and Justin Deoliveira).
We have been discussing a large number of topics, but one
of the major
discussions has been on the Geoserver Enterprise Edition.
This is basically a new plug-in and extension-point based
system for
doing Geo-based web application (including things like WFS
and WMS and
WCS). And "customizing" existing applications. For
example, the SIS
stuff "plugging in" to WFS, and geo-wiki things. The new
Enterprise
edition will take geoserver from an application to a
platform for
developing and customizing web-based geo-applications.
We have discussed how we would provide services for most of what's
been
talked about on the mailing list and the few IRC
meetings. I think
you're going to be very excited about it. We are going to write
up our
ideas for next week and hope to get some feedback from you.
Great!!! I'll wait to see what you came up with with much
interest!!!
dave
Bye Paolo
ps. from the last meeting, it appears the "data/catalog" portion
of the
framework will be somewhat like an expanded "DataEngine"
(from the IRC
meeting).
I feel this is fundamental, so I'm happy to know we're
quite tuned on it!!!
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